we are looking for the appropriate present day authorization and not 2001 but 2015 by USA congress authority to go forward to degrade or destroy Daesh (he said Daesh). "Daesh has to be stopped. the usa is best when we act together and we will act as a nation without regard to party."
I don't believe any Democrat opposes the AUMF because of party, it is due to HISTORY that they oppose it.
demonstrators in the room - "No Endless War. No more killing of innocent people"
Kerry states how would anyone feel about the beheaded journalist to call them innocent people.
He has to know that is not what the demonstrator was referring to.
These entries are not necessarily direct quotes so much as NOTED.
Kerry states Daesh has been degraded already. The presidents request is what he needs to provide flexibility to the goal of the military.
More Demonstrators. The USA is killing innocent civilians.
"What a mistake it would be to send a message to Daesh there is a safe place." Daesh is unique in the world today because it has resources, acts of genocide, the crucifixtion of children and the plunder of cities and the destruction of historical articles. etc.
Coalition is committed to ending Daesh. Coalition of nations that disagree on other areas, but, agree this war is important to end Daesh. Tikrit 1000 Sunnis taking part - cross section of engagement
The Threat by ISIL is not a partisan issue - not even a bipartisan issue - it transcends affiliations - he is happy to answer questions
Carter - Ah, the helicopter - we know there were four air crew from army in Louisiana and marines from Camp LeJune, NC - search and rescue continues -
the enemy can be defeated - secretary carter was impressed by the people he met when he began his visit in Kuwait - the civilian personnel and the military personnel will know the country is behind them from the request by the president - there is the reality of ISIL stated in the president's request including its' affiliation with other groups - the enduring reality referred to by the president is that quality of local authority of the countries in the region - three year reassessment and Sec. Carter states this is a reasonable proposal even though the mission may not have ended - the president's proposal has come together with our allies in the region to seriously end ISIL - the president wants those allied with the usa efforts are taken seriously and stands unflinchingly behind them
Dempsey - condolences to those lost on that helicopter today (Yeah, a forty year old helicopter - thanks a lot.) - he has spent time with his counter parts of our allies - ISIL is a trans-regional threat - our enemies will adapt their tactics and we will adapt ours - our troops already there are performing magnificently (Okay, but they need new equipment without blastedly stupid computers to mess them up and be tracked as they fight!)
Corker of Carter - our people believe the outrages Sec. Kerry stated is the point of view I have experienced - I am sure the Congress wants a good outcomes - Dempsey agrees - Corker Iran has shia militia on the ground - is that a concern
- Dempsey 6 things about iran
regional - surrogate and proxies in lebanon
ballistic missile tech
weapons trafficking
global - nuclear aspirations for weapon
cyber activities
the iranian support is a good thing for the region but he worries about the direction for the iranian support when the war is over - there is no indication the Iranians will turn on us - but are acts of retribution possible and ethnic cleansing with the people in the region - we are watching carefully
Corker - he is pursuing his politics and is wording his questions to bring out the answers he is hope for. - does the AUMF the president protect others from Assad - Turkey has asked to approve them on the ground in Syria to improve the ground effort
Dempsey - goal is more than containment of ISIL in Syria - air power is distributed with 'credible partners' - Iraq is such a partner, but, no such partner yet in Syria - ISIL can no longer travel across the iraq-syria border - no syria regime for Assad - military impact would be...
Oh, shut up Corker he isn't going to be manipulated.
Dempsey - article one advise under my responsibility - the moral issue is not ignored - Gen. Dempsey states everyone is in discussion as to how we protect the forces ongoing - he is willing to develop whatever aspect of military support needed
Menendez - no geographic limitation in AUMF - it was found best after debate to take on that characteristic to the permission for war - does ISIL have ambitions beyond what they are doing already - the Tikrit operation is a reflection point to the way forward - Menendez - we have different goals in regard to Iraq's character after the war, democratic, etc. - Dempsey - deal with campaign as presently designed - the president's request in authorization will provide flexibility to address needs that are military - i will always go back ot the commander and chief and state there is needs that have to be altered. president will have final word on military movements in my requests - Menendez - before joint chiefs last week stated mission based - there is no word called enduring in military vocabulary but the definition is understood
Menendez to Carter - Carter - no enduring offensive - two ingredients - how and when - the AUMf as proposed as noted provides for wide range of activities to defeat ISIL but has one limitation - does not authorize the kind of campaign the usa conducted in iraq or Afghanistan - there is that limitation by definition and three year limit for reassessment
Memedez to Kerry - any objection to specifically any other previous AUMF - Kerry - only if that it was clear there was no returning to previous AUMF - this AUMF will specifically be in regard to this war and the only war power in this AUMF and no other previous AUMF
Carter - "associated with ISIL and thereat of Americans"
Rubion - "Iran's goal is to be the regional hegemonic power." - Carter - yes - i don't know what they are thinking - Dempsey - they have the same suspicion of us as we do of them - Kerry - because the facts contradict some of those aspects of understand and I cannot state everything here - Rubio "Iran is not a fan of the us (USA) bombing in the area." - Kerry - he thinks Rubio is misreading the region - Iran might be nervous with about our plans but they aren't going to refuse the help we provide - i think the greater picture includes the shia permission - president has stated iran will not get a nuclear weapon to dominate the region - Rubio - i believe our military strategy is our refusal to cross red lines (he's political, too) - Kerry states Rubio is flat wrong because the secretary has spoken to all the powers in the region and they back the usa in what it is doing in the region - the power are not perfectly comfortable, they are nervous, they don't want a nuclear presence in the region - their support was public in a news conference - Rubio - ISIS in afghanistan - how does the AUMF deal with that? - Dempsey - TTTP has adopted the methods of ISIL - not necessarily a presence in afghanistan - Rubio - growth of ISIS affiliate in afghanistan would pose a threat to usa - Dempsey - any growth in afghanistan would pose a threat to the region first and then perhaps us (USA)
Cardin - republicans not willing to give AUMF in last congress - there concerns - 2001 authorization and why nothing in request that deals with it - enduring is defined as what - how does this requrest deal with associated forces - there are other authorizations that have time limits and this one is not unusal - three sunset on 2001 authorization as well as this AUMF
Carter - the 2001 authorization covered al qaeda and successive peninsula - there is a difference - currently 14 year history of al qaeda tenacity and one has to debate whether ending 2001 is best sunset - Cardin - president has expressed a revisit of the 2001 AUMF - the USA has to protect itself and the history with al qaeda is significant - Cardin- best to take up the topic now
Cardin - enduring means lasting and permanent - why can't enduring be interpreted in iraq and afghanistan as well - Carter - i am not a lawyer - the interpretation that draftees of that document apply to afghan and iraq - Kerry - clearly the USA committed troops for a long period of time, the president has ruled that out (Of course he did because 'enduring' relates to the development of the military of sovereign states in the region. knowing that means the purpose of this AUMF will end at the end of it's mission to develop the military of other countries in the region) - Cardin - the next administration may have a totally different idea of this authorization - Kerry - congress will have the authority of the sunset of three years (that is exactly the problem - if there is another neocon in the exeuctive office there is no controlling the outcomes for the nation and the world for that matter)
Johnson - there are a lot of loose statements (i have no good opinion of this guy - he is inflammatory regardless the topic) - puzzled by the fact this administration already has the authority to do what it is doing already - why a new authorization - let's look at words - (basically johnson doesn't recognize the purpose of enduring is that of permanent forces in the sovereign nations involved. Oh for cryin' out loud he is talking about the Japanese empire. and now Dempsey is suppose to decide what kind of AUMF he wants - the japanese reference is better than the president's) - Dempsey - you are talking about a 1941 document. I was consulted by the President - Johnson - why would anyone want to pick a fight with the USA - Carter - it is based in potential for an attack - Dempsey - about 1000 sunni folks, 3000 iraqi brigade - 20 thousand of the popular mobilization force which are the shia militia - johnson - the shia militias are iranian - dempsey - they are trained and equipped by iran (if anyone wants to note the reality of the iranain involvement - Iran sent a least one general into iraq to assist in leading the militias. yes? yes. WHAT MODEL IS THAT? let me help ya, that is the same exact model the USA is using with the iraqi forces and kurds. why is that important? because iran cares about the people in iraq and is paralleling the efforts by the USA so the shia militias are performing well within their faith and a direct partner to the soldiers the USA is involved in. - Iran is benevolent in every aspect in this effort no different than any countries in the coalition - Iran is earnest in being a good partner in Iraq. that is all too obvious to me) - johnson sees a lack of commit by this administration to the defeat of iran - WAR - johnson wants a war with Iran - extremist - the letter - the congressional neocons have a very real agenda and they are going to try to create such a war with this AUMF
Kaine - no enduring operations long term for the usa as if iraq or afghanistan - he wants a definition of enduring - Carter - long term commitments of that size (667 million troops - i think Senator Kaine misspoke and meant 66,700 as if first gulf war) - Dempsey - the new AUMF would not allow that to occur -Kaine - King of Jordan stated to him, "This is not your fight this is our fight." - the Jordan King does need help but no American ground troops because it would be a recruiting object -the USA has conducted 80% of the air strikes so is the ground troop statement without the actual picture? - i see a real danger of a ground troop creep - how to guard against that both as mission and definition - Kerry - the authorization in it's current form will guard against that - the enduring transformation that has to occur here won't happen if the USA is providing all the ground troops to end this problem - it would only provide a greater opportunity for still yet another problem in the future - the region has to deny the narrative to a repeat of a group like Daesh -the USA has to work on the integration of Iraq and region to have it's own capacity to protect in the future and to protect against mission creep
Senator Flake -the AUMF is over due - many of us are uncomfortable with the limitations in the december bill - at what point does it become not useful to be passed with a partisan vote - is that worse than no AUMF at all - Kerry - Absolutely - the executive branch is convinced we have the authority now because ISIL changed it's name from al qaeda in iraq - they have extensive history of attacking american forces - ISIL is a glorified name from the point the USA first engaged them - the new AUMF would bring about the current situation - questioning the staying power of the USA is stated by some Senators - that has to be answered by this new AUMF - Flake - i am not troubled by three year sunset, but, we need to value language that a bipartisan vote will result - looks to moving forward and thanks the panel for their testimony
Senator Murphy - every Senator seems to have their own definition of these words - we need to get on the same page on this - there should be no vagueness otherwise we will be back to the same AUMF as before - the bill will be for limited partnership with allies engaged in hostilities against that organization - Carter - "I think you are reading it right." - common sense answer that focuses on the fight against ISIL - there are other authorities from 2001 that could support actions against boko haram - this AUMF only addresses the ISIL fight - prefers to have flexibility but it doesn't authorize what iraq and afghanistan does - we are enabling a force that will provide a lasting victory against ISIL which is empowerment of the countries in the coalition - this AUMF encompasses the problems as they exist now - Murphy - there is significant division in our parties in regard to Iran and it has the intention to undermine the authority of the president - what is ramifications of that letter - Kerry -my reaction to the letter was utter disbelief and in my 23 years in the Senate there was never anything proposed or even discussed as to a letter such as this....there is always the right to decent, but, to give a constitutional lesson based inaccuracy is not correct - the EXECUTIVE AGREEMENT is the standard used for centuries from the earliest period of USA history - it is the Executive Agreement that is the standard - we don't even have diplomatic relations with Iran right now - the letter states it is a legally binding agreement with Iran and that is flatly wrong - all the P5+1 will sign off on the Executive Agreement or not - but the letter risks foreign government dealing with the USA - they will get the impression they will have to deal with 545 members of Congress and that is flatly false - Iran has to make hard choices and we know a nuclear armed Iran is not to happen - Corker - "That is a well worded speech." - Kerry "This is not a speech..." - Corker - five minutes and 25 second later - all are upset by the veto threat, etc. - Gardner interrupts Secretary Kerry - ISIL is losing it's fight against it. - only on January 26th it was understood they were a very dangerous threat - to Carter - the campaign may not end in three years and the next president could still use 2001 other than this one - Carter - the president is going to review the 2001 after this is settled - the time period for the campaign is based in the respect of the next president and their assessment - the president chooses not to impose any long duration of his authority on another president - there is no set time frame on the mission regarding ISIL - ( the answer is the GOAL is to empower the gulf powers to defend their own sovereign countries - that dictates the length. am I the only one listening? where are everyone's heads and what translation of the english language do we need?) - Oh, wait, let's see if Secretary Carter will trip over himself if he is given enough rope. Very cute.
You'll excuse me if I open my emails while listening to this, right?
Gardner - what weight of effort are the other fighting units in the region pursuing against ISIL - Dempsey - the Kurds are carrying the majority of effort - i can't really put a percentage on that - early efforts against ISIL was in the north and that was the Kurds - we vanquished our way through the initial friction depriving Kurds of military munitions but it may occur.
Senator Shaheen - doesn't like the language of the reporting function of the AUMF - prefers reporting every 60 days and clearly defined objectives - there is a benefit in providing additional detail rather than less - it provides more information to the mission as well - Kerry - first of all the plan is reduced to writing and the president reviews it so it needs to be specific - there is a balance here to the actual military battle and the hours put into a report that is often not thoroughly read - six months really is not much time when it comes to the outcome of the plan - accountability would be important - "...there is a balance..." - that is his opinion - Carter - balance is the right word and both of you are seeking that - Dempsey - it was aligned somewhat in how we do our war powers authority so it was aligned with that
Shaheen - the 2001 provides authority of which we have protect ourselves - do we need that AUMF to protect ourselves - i doubt those specific words are necessary in this AUMF - Carter - my understanding submitted explicitely states it supercedes the 2001 AUMF and the president wants to revisit the 2001 AUMF - we do need the continuing authority to protect ourselves against others that are not ISIL - Shaheen - the president is open to language not on this request - Kerry - i don't know there was a specific willingness to accept other language, but, he would invite that opportunity - i personally have not heard that direct permission regarding the language
Senator Perdue - please respond to 'the enemy of your enemy is your enemy' - Dempsey - that is proving to exist with the nuclear program with Iran - ISIL is generational, transregional, important on a state on state conflict is very different than military non-state conflict - airstrikes are direct action and we are building up the understanding the region rejects ISIL and that requires a different component than (direct, build partners and enabling partners - there seems to find a need for a limiting factor - the limiting factor is that the use of USA power will not defeat this enemy alone - Iran is going to be influential in Iraq and I am concerned about the way they will wield that power and of course what occurs when the conflict is over with ISIL, will Iran's influence seek to eliminate the sunnis and kurds from the region - it is that uncertainty to Iran's influence that concerns me -
Dempsey - my first 35 years was all about state to state defense and the last 15 years has encompassed both state on state and state on non-state and the USA is adapting to this very well. "I don't want to make a budget statement here, but, we will have problems if we don't get some increased spending soon."
Senator Markey - Libya - Carter - the 2001 AUMF is applied to Libya - Markey - the goal with our efforts with Syria is to remove Assad - what does that mean if Assad is gone by the moderates - are we committed to back them to oppose Assad because that is their public goal - how does this AUMF square with that? - Kerry- the congress has approved the training and equip program - the AUMF is ISIL specific and does not provide actions against Assad - Markey - are we not providing the removal of Assad by strengthening the moderate Syrians - Kerry - this authorization is for the degrading and destroying ISIL - we are not in Syria - if the moderate Syrian military succeeds in removing Assad then it will be an achieved goal of the moderates and we stated that fact publicly
Corker - a bill by Senator Markey and president is noted - Markey - the letter is inappropriate and timing was very bad
Senator Isakson - thanks Kerry for service - nice, i appreciate that myself - Sec Kerry you and I have served together in Vietnam - you know this will have implications for politics - first president ever to mention radical islam was Jackson - the fact is there is no end to this conflict as a thought provoking comments - Kerry - i am delighted you stayed on the committee while passing a few other leadership positions up and i appreciate that because you'll be a strong voice on this committee - Kerry - i am confident everyone in the region and world will appreciate and understand the goal of three years to bring political pressure as well - the three years is a statement of respect by personnel choice to the next president - there may be state of the art refinements - all the nations in the region are committed to remove ISIL, every country - Isakson - the congress and service need to be united
Senator Coons - concerned about the service people lost with the helicopter today - now the families will be going to Dover AFB - who bears the cost regarding ISIS - DOD budget is appreciated in General Dempsey's words - spending cuts and increased of revenue have been applied to the DOD - we can renew the conversation in funding for DOD but believes there is a limit on the spending in regard to the ISIL conflict - Carter - that question is not best associated with AUMF - we are in a situation of one in which we have had a year after year of turmoil and that is true of the state department as well - it effects management of the military on a continuing basis - Coons - i am uncomfortable to continue to use OCO (Overseas Contingency Operations) funds for this - what does associated forces mean - does this AUMF qualify for those groups - Kerry - as of now there is no decision made that the associated groups are covered by this AUMF - if the groups were to have ambitions to attack the USA there would have to be open to judgement - people keeps saying 'we don't trust iran' - there is no understanding in this AUMF based in trust - it is based in mistrust
Senator Risch - this is a difficult needle to threat because of the wide views in congress - for Dempsey - if this passes what will change - Dempsey - there won't be any difference in our activities - there will be a difference in the partners as they view our part in this - Risch - i signed this letter and the chest beating over this letter is nonsense - members of congress communicate every single day and we leave on planes to go to meet with leaders of other governments during recesses - there are disagreements regarding the treaty being decided - this agreement is the same thing as the START treaty - THAT is nonsense - Iran is not Russia and Russia is not Iran - Russia had nuclear weapons and the entire arsenal of both the USA and Russia was ridiculoudly high in number - this is nothing now but politics
Senator Rand Paul - the constitution written by Madison lends itself easily to the Executive Branch for war and the declaration of war is left to the congress for that reason - he doesn't appreciate lectures about the constitution by this executive branch - he views the actions by this administration as illegal and unconstitutional - politics again - the letter was more signed for the attention of the administration because it doesn't listen - the letter should have been cc'd to the white house - there are couple of things that bother me about AUMF - the target is related to September 11th, boko haram is not in that statement - (this was just covered, i suppose Senator Paul was not in the room, which is very legal and full of liberty) - what is the number of troops - Carter - the request by the president in this AUMF does not have a number in it - there should be a scope to define involvement - the campaign is to enable the region to make a victory stick - Paul - without a geographic language that includes boko haram - if boko haram is a part of this i'll sign it - if 2001 can be applied to boko haram then i am very concerned about this AUMF - if we are to go to war with libya then i want to sign an AUMF that states we are going to war with libya - there are those of us who worry we could be at war in 30 different nations with the language of this request - Carter - the AUMF provides a wide enough range of associated groups to bring balance to the region effected but there is a limit to the engagement by military personnel (drones) - there is a new chapter in our effort with nigeria as of last summer - that is a practical fact as of last summer - i am not accusing you of plotting the country involvement with this AUMF - i have to explain this to my children 15 years from now as to why we did this
Corker - apologizes to Sec. Kerry for prolonging his stay at the committee meeting if he has other commitments - Kerry - today the us treasury has engaged more sanctions on Yanukovych folks and added more non-lethal assistance
Corker turns to General Dempsey but Carter answers - the legal authority to respond to an attack by Assad is not known yet - ya think? (there is no AUMF yet, is that right?)
Corker - he is concerned about protecting folks against Assad - (someone needs to remind him of the successful removal of chemical weapons - Dempsey - appreciates the chairman's concern for our time today - states corker has run a very cordial meeting today and that was nice - the program won't succeed unless the trained troops understand they have a strong sense of survival - Corker - to get Turkey on the ground - Dempsey - effective ground effort - Dempsey - military advise is under discussion now - the AUMF would not provide that permission today - Carter - there could be provisions when the forces we equip are under attack can receive support but all this is under discussions - Corner - states there is lack of commitment from the white house if all this isn't up front in the AUMF - Persian Gulf War - enduring ground combat language - seven month authorization would be too long for this AUMF - Carter - going against another state is different than this and I don't believe that will apply here - Corker - is 2 to 3 years too long for enduring? - Carter - we don't know how long it will take to defeat ISIS - the three years is based in realizing there will be another president to assess this (Why don't they remember that?)
Menendez - we need to find relief form sequester - get to a point to find the right balance to degrade and defeat ISIL but it is not an open ended check - some of us who lived under 'shock and awe' was told iraqi oil would pay for everything and that was a deception - today there is not a democrat or republican that is not committed to degrade and end ISIL it is just a matter of finding the exact language.
Corker - he has a note - the DOD senior lawyers are sitting behind you - neither one of this AUMF or 2001 provides for training and equipping anti-Assad forces - i would like to close how much we appreciate you and the service to our country - the record is open to friday and there will be questions allowed until then - meeting adjourned.
end
continued...
I don't believe any Democrat opposes the AUMF because of party, it is due to HISTORY that they oppose it.
demonstrators in the room - "No Endless War. No more killing of innocent people"
Kerry states how would anyone feel about the beheaded journalist to call them innocent people.
He has to know that is not what the demonstrator was referring to.
These entries are not necessarily direct quotes so much as NOTED.
Kerry states Daesh has been degraded already. The presidents request is what he needs to provide flexibility to the goal of the military.
More Demonstrators. The USA is killing innocent civilians.
"What a mistake it would be to send a message to Daesh there is a safe place." Daesh is unique in the world today because it has resources, acts of genocide, the crucifixtion of children and the plunder of cities and the destruction of historical articles. etc.
Coalition is committed to ending Daesh. Coalition of nations that disagree on other areas, but, agree this war is important to end Daesh. Tikrit 1000 Sunnis taking part - cross section of engagement
The Threat by ISIL is not a partisan issue - not even a bipartisan issue - it transcends affiliations - he is happy to answer questions
Carter - Ah, the helicopter - we know there were four air crew from army in Louisiana and marines from Camp LeJune, NC - search and rescue continues -
the enemy can be defeated - secretary carter was impressed by the people he met when he began his visit in Kuwait - the civilian personnel and the military personnel will know the country is behind them from the request by the president - there is the reality of ISIL stated in the president's request including its' affiliation with other groups - the enduring reality referred to by the president is that quality of local authority of the countries in the region - three year reassessment and Sec. Carter states this is a reasonable proposal even though the mission may not have ended - the president's proposal has come together with our allies in the region to seriously end ISIL - the president wants those allied with the usa efforts are taken seriously and stands unflinchingly behind them
Dempsey - condolences to those lost on that helicopter today (Yeah, a forty year old helicopter - thanks a lot.) - he has spent time with his counter parts of our allies - ISIL is a trans-regional threat - our enemies will adapt their tactics and we will adapt ours - our troops already there are performing magnificently (Okay, but they need new equipment without blastedly stupid computers to mess them up and be tracked as they fight!)
Corker of Carter - our people believe the outrages Sec. Kerry stated is the point of view I have experienced - I am sure the Congress wants a good outcomes - Dempsey agrees - Corker Iran has shia militia on the ground - is that a concern
- Dempsey 6 things about iran
regional - surrogate and proxies in lebanon
ballistic missile tech
weapons trafficking
global - nuclear aspirations for weapon
cyber activities
the iranian support is a good thing for the region but he worries about the direction for the iranian support when the war is over - there is no indication the Iranians will turn on us - but are acts of retribution possible and ethnic cleansing with the people in the region - we are watching carefully
Corker - he is pursuing his politics and is wording his questions to bring out the answers he is hope for. - does the AUMF the president protect others from Assad - Turkey has asked to approve them on the ground in Syria to improve the ground effort
Dempsey - goal is more than containment of ISIL in Syria - air power is distributed with 'credible partners' - Iraq is such a partner, but, no such partner yet in Syria - ISIL can no longer travel across the iraq-syria border - no syria regime for Assad - military impact would be...
Oh, shut up Corker he isn't going to be manipulated.
Dempsey - article one advise under my responsibility - the moral issue is not ignored - Gen. Dempsey states everyone is in discussion as to how we protect the forces ongoing - he is willing to develop whatever aspect of military support needed
Menendez - no geographic limitation in AUMF - it was found best after debate to take on that characteristic to the permission for war - does ISIL have ambitions beyond what they are doing already - the Tikrit operation is a reflection point to the way forward - Menendez - we have different goals in regard to Iraq's character after the war, democratic, etc. - Dempsey - deal with campaign as presently designed - the president's request in authorization will provide flexibility to address needs that are military - i will always go back ot the commander and chief and state there is needs that have to be altered. president will have final word on military movements in my requests - Menendez - before joint chiefs last week stated mission based - there is no word called enduring in military vocabulary but the definition is understood
Menendez to Carter - Carter - no enduring offensive - two ingredients - how and when - the AUMf as proposed as noted provides for wide range of activities to defeat ISIL but has one limitation - does not authorize the kind of campaign the usa conducted in iraq or Afghanistan - there is that limitation by definition and three year limit for reassessment
Memedez to Kerry - any objection to specifically any other previous AUMF - Kerry - only if that it was clear there was no returning to previous AUMF - this AUMF will specifically be in regard to this war and the only war power in this AUMF and no other previous AUMF
Carter - "associated with ISIL and thereat of Americans"
Rubion - "Iran's goal is to be the regional hegemonic power." - Carter - yes - i don't know what they are thinking - Dempsey - they have the same suspicion of us as we do of them - Kerry - because the facts contradict some of those aspects of understand and I cannot state everything here - Rubio "Iran is not a fan of the us (USA) bombing in the area." - Kerry - he thinks Rubio is misreading the region - Iran might be nervous with about our plans but they aren't going to refuse the help we provide - i think the greater picture includes the shia permission - president has stated iran will not get a nuclear weapon to dominate the region - Rubio - i believe our military strategy is our refusal to cross red lines (he's political, too) - Kerry states Rubio is flat wrong because the secretary has spoken to all the powers in the region and they back the usa in what it is doing in the region - the power are not perfectly comfortable, they are nervous, they don't want a nuclear presence in the region - their support was public in a news conference - Rubio - ISIS in afghanistan - how does the AUMF deal with that? - Dempsey - TTTP has adopted the methods of ISIL - not necessarily a presence in afghanistan - Rubio - growth of ISIS affiliate in afghanistan would pose a threat to usa - Dempsey - any growth in afghanistan would pose a threat to the region first and then perhaps us (USA)
Cardin - republicans not willing to give AUMF in last congress - there concerns - 2001 authorization and why nothing in request that deals with it - enduring is defined as what - how does this requrest deal with associated forces - there are other authorizations that have time limits and this one is not unusal - three sunset on 2001 authorization as well as this AUMF
Carter - the 2001 authorization covered al qaeda and successive peninsula - there is a difference - currently 14 year history of al qaeda tenacity and one has to debate whether ending 2001 is best sunset - Cardin - president has expressed a revisit of the 2001 AUMF - the USA has to protect itself and the history with al qaeda is significant - Cardin- best to take up the topic now
Cardin - enduring means lasting and permanent - why can't enduring be interpreted in iraq and afghanistan as well - Carter - i am not a lawyer - the interpretation that draftees of that document apply to afghan and iraq - Kerry - clearly the USA committed troops for a long period of time, the president has ruled that out (Of course he did because 'enduring' relates to the development of the military of sovereign states in the region. knowing that means the purpose of this AUMF will end at the end of it's mission to develop the military of other countries in the region) - Cardin - the next administration may have a totally different idea of this authorization - Kerry - congress will have the authority of the sunset of three years (that is exactly the problem - if there is another neocon in the exeuctive office there is no controlling the outcomes for the nation and the world for that matter)
Johnson - there are a lot of loose statements (i have no good opinion of this guy - he is inflammatory regardless the topic) - puzzled by the fact this administration already has the authority to do what it is doing already - why a new authorization - let's look at words - (basically johnson doesn't recognize the purpose of enduring is that of permanent forces in the sovereign nations involved. Oh for cryin' out loud he is talking about the Japanese empire. and now Dempsey is suppose to decide what kind of AUMF he wants - the japanese reference is better than the president's) - Dempsey - you are talking about a 1941 document. I was consulted by the President - Johnson - why would anyone want to pick a fight with the USA - Carter - it is based in potential for an attack - Dempsey - about 1000 sunni folks, 3000 iraqi brigade - 20 thousand of the popular mobilization force which are the shia militia - johnson - the shia militias are iranian - dempsey - they are trained and equipped by iran (if anyone wants to note the reality of the iranain involvement - Iran sent a least one general into iraq to assist in leading the militias. yes? yes. WHAT MODEL IS THAT? let me help ya, that is the same exact model the USA is using with the iraqi forces and kurds. why is that important? because iran cares about the people in iraq and is paralleling the efforts by the USA so the shia militias are performing well within their faith and a direct partner to the soldiers the USA is involved in. - Iran is benevolent in every aspect in this effort no different than any countries in the coalition - Iran is earnest in being a good partner in Iraq. that is all too obvious to me) - johnson sees a lack of commit by this administration to the defeat of iran - WAR - johnson wants a war with Iran - extremist - the letter - the congressional neocons have a very real agenda and they are going to try to create such a war with this AUMF
Kaine - no enduring operations long term for the usa as if iraq or afghanistan - he wants a definition of enduring - Carter - long term commitments of that size (667 million troops - i think Senator Kaine misspoke and meant 66,700 as if first gulf war) - Dempsey - the new AUMF would not allow that to occur -Kaine - King of Jordan stated to him, "This is not your fight this is our fight." - the Jordan King does need help but no American ground troops because it would be a recruiting object -the USA has conducted 80% of the air strikes so is the ground troop statement without the actual picture? - i see a real danger of a ground troop creep - how to guard against that both as mission and definition - Kerry - the authorization in it's current form will guard against that - the enduring transformation that has to occur here won't happen if the USA is providing all the ground troops to end this problem - it would only provide a greater opportunity for still yet another problem in the future - the region has to deny the narrative to a repeat of a group like Daesh -the USA has to work on the integration of Iraq and region to have it's own capacity to protect in the future and to protect against mission creep
Senator Flake -the AUMF is over due - many of us are uncomfortable with the limitations in the december bill - at what point does it become not useful to be passed with a partisan vote - is that worse than no AUMF at all - Kerry - Absolutely - the executive branch is convinced we have the authority now because ISIL changed it's name from al qaeda in iraq - they have extensive history of attacking american forces - ISIL is a glorified name from the point the USA first engaged them - the new AUMF would bring about the current situation - questioning the staying power of the USA is stated by some Senators - that has to be answered by this new AUMF - Flake - i am not troubled by three year sunset, but, we need to value language that a bipartisan vote will result - looks to moving forward and thanks the panel for their testimony
Senator Murphy - every Senator seems to have their own definition of these words - we need to get on the same page on this - there should be no vagueness otherwise we will be back to the same AUMF as before - the bill will be for limited partnership with allies engaged in hostilities against that organization - Carter - "I think you are reading it right." - common sense answer that focuses on the fight against ISIL - there are other authorities from 2001 that could support actions against boko haram - this AUMF only addresses the ISIL fight - prefers to have flexibility but it doesn't authorize what iraq and afghanistan does - we are enabling a force that will provide a lasting victory against ISIL which is empowerment of the countries in the coalition - this AUMF encompasses the problems as they exist now - Murphy - there is significant division in our parties in regard to Iran and it has the intention to undermine the authority of the president - what is ramifications of that letter - Kerry -my reaction to the letter was utter disbelief and in my 23 years in the Senate there was never anything proposed or even discussed as to a letter such as this....there is always the right to decent, but, to give a constitutional lesson based inaccuracy is not correct - the EXECUTIVE AGREEMENT is the standard used for centuries from the earliest period of USA history - it is the Executive Agreement that is the standard - we don't even have diplomatic relations with Iran right now - the letter states it is a legally binding agreement with Iran and that is flatly wrong - all the P5+1 will sign off on the Executive Agreement or not - but the letter risks foreign government dealing with the USA - they will get the impression they will have to deal with 545 members of Congress and that is flatly false - Iran has to make hard choices and we know a nuclear armed Iran is not to happen - Corker - "That is a well worded speech." - Kerry "This is not a speech..." - Corker - five minutes and 25 second later - all are upset by the veto threat, etc. - Gardner interrupts Secretary Kerry - ISIL is losing it's fight against it. - only on January 26th it was understood they were a very dangerous threat - to Carter - the campaign may not end in three years and the next president could still use 2001 other than this one - Carter - the president is going to review the 2001 after this is settled - the time period for the campaign is based in the respect of the next president and their assessment - the president chooses not to impose any long duration of his authority on another president - there is no set time frame on the mission regarding ISIL - ( the answer is the GOAL is to empower the gulf powers to defend their own sovereign countries - that dictates the length. am I the only one listening? where are everyone's heads and what translation of the english language do we need?) - Oh, wait, let's see if Secretary Carter will trip over himself if he is given enough rope. Very cute.
You'll excuse me if I open my emails while listening to this, right?
Gardner - what weight of effort are the other fighting units in the region pursuing against ISIL - Dempsey - the Kurds are carrying the majority of effort - i can't really put a percentage on that - early efforts against ISIL was in the north and that was the Kurds - we vanquished our way through the initial friction depriving Kurds of military munitions but it may occur.
Senator Shaheen - doesn't like the language of the reporting function of the AUMF - prefers reporting every 60 days and clearly defined objectives - there is a benefit in providing additional detail rather than less - it provides more information to the mission as well - Kerry - first of all the plan is reduced to writing and the president reviews it so it needs to be specific - there is a balance here to the actual military battle and the hours put into a report that is often not thoroughly read - six months really is not much time when it comes to the outcome of the plan - accountability would be important - "...there is a balance..." - that is his opinion - Carter - balance is the right word and both of you are seeking that - Dempsey - it was aligned somewhat in how we do our war powers authority so it was aligned with that
Shaheen - the 2001 provides authority of which we have protect ourselves - do we need that AUMF to protect ourselves - i doubt those specific words are necessary in this AUMF - Carter - my understanding submitted explicitely states it supercedes the 2001 AUMF and the president wants to revisit the 2001 AUMF - we do need the continuing authority to protect ourselves against others that are not ISIL - Shaheen - the president is open to language not on this request - Kerry - i don't know there was a specific willingness to accept other language, but, he would invite that opportunity - i personally have not heard that direct permission regarding the language
Senator Perdue - please respond to 'the enemy of your enemy is your enemy' - Dempsey - that is proving to exist with the nuclear program with Iran - ISIL is generational, transregional, important on a state on state conflict is very different than military non-state conflict - airstrikes are direct action and we are building up the understanding the region rejects ISIL and that requires a different component than (direct, build partners and enabling partners - there seems to find a need for a limiting factor - the limiting factor is that the use of USA power will not defeat this enemy alone - Iran is going to be influential in Iraq and I am concerned about the way they will wield that power and of course what occurs when the conflict is over with ISIL, will Iran's influence seek to eliminate the sunnis and kurds from the region - it is that uncertainty to Iran's influence that concerns me -
Dempsey - my first 35 years was all about state to state defense and the last 15 years has encompassed both state on state and state on non-state and the USA is adapting to this very well. "I don't want to make a budget statement here, but, we will have problems if we don't get some increased spending soon."
Senator Markey - Libya - Carter - the 2001 AUMF is applied to Libya - Markey - the goal with our efforts with Syria is to remove Assad - what does that mean if Assad is gone by the moderates - are we committed to back them to oppose Assad because that is their public goal - how does this AUMF square with that? - Kerry- the congress has approved the training and equip program - the AUMF is ISIL specific and does not provide actions against Assad - Markey - are we not providing the removal of Assad by strengthening the moderate Syrians - Kerry - this authorization is for the degrading and destroying ISIL - we are not in Syria - if the moderate Syrian military succeeds in removing Assad then it will be an achieved goal of the moderates and we stated that fact publicly
Corker - a bill by Senator Markey and president is noted - Markey - the letter is inappropriate and timing was very bad
Senator Isakson - thanks Kerry for service - nice, i appreciate that myself - Sec Kerry you and I have served together in Vietnam - you know this will have implications for politics - first president ever to mention radical islam was Jackson - the fact is there is no end to this conflict as a thought provoking comments - Kerry - i am delighted you stayed on the committee while passing a few other leadership positions up and i appreciate that because you'll be a strong voice on this committee - Kerry - i am confident everyone in the region and world will appreciate and understand the goal of three years to bring political pressure as well - the three years is a statement of respect by personnel choice to the next president - there may be state of the art refinements - all the nations in the region are committed to remove ISIL, every country - Isakson - the congress and service need to be united
Senator Coons - concerned about the service people lost with the helicopter today - now the families will be going to Dover AFB - who bears the cost regarding ISIS - DOD budget is appreciated in General Dempsey's words - spending cuts and increased of revenue have been applied to the DOD - we can renew the conversation in funding for DOD but believes there is a limit on the spending in regard to the ISIL conflict - Carter - that question is not best associated with AUMF - we are in a situation of one in which we have had a year after year of turmoil and that is true of the state department as well - it effects management of the military on a continuing basis - Coons - i am uncomfortable to continue to use OCO (Overseas Contingency Operations) funds for this - what does associated forces mean - does this AUMF qualify for those groups - Kerry - as of now there is no decision made that the associated groups are covered by this AUMF - if the groups were to have ambitions to attack the USA there would have to be open to judgement - people keeps saying 'we don't trust iran' - there is no understanding in this AUMF based in trust - it is based in mistrust
Senator Risch - this is a difficult needle to threat because of the wide views in congress - for Dempsey - if this passes what will change - Dempsey - there won't be any difference in our activities - there will be a difference in the partners as they view our part in this - Risch - i signed this letter and the chest beating over this letter is nonsense - members of congress communicate every single day and we leave on planes to go to meet with leaders of other governments during recesses - there are disagreements regarding the treaty being decided - this agreement is the same thing as the START treaty - THAT is nonsense - Iran is not Russia and Russia is not Iran - Russia had nuclear weapons and the entire arsenal of both the USA and Russia was ridiculoudly high in number - this is nothing now but politics
Senator Rand Paul - the constitution written by Madison lends itself easily to the Executive Branch for war and the declaration of war is left to the congress for that reason - he doesn't appreciate lectures about the constitution by this executive branch - he views the actions by this administration as illegal and unconstitutional - politics again - the letter was more signed for the attention of the administration because it doesn't listen - the letter should have been cc'd to the white house - there are couple of things that bother me about AUMF - the target is related to September 11th, boko haram is not in that statement - (this was just covered, i suppose Senator Paul was not in the room, which is very legal and full of liberty) - what is the number of troops - Carter - the request by the president in this AUMF does not have a number in it - there should be a scope to define involvement - the campaign is to enable the region to make a victory stick - Paul - without a geographic language that includes boko haram - if boko haram is a part of this i'll sign it - if 2001 can be applied to boko haram then i am very concerned about this AUMF - if we are to go to war with libya then i want to sign an AUMF that states we are going to war with libya - there are those of us who worry we could be at war in 30 different nations with the language of this request - Carter - the AUMF provides a wide enough range of associated groups to bring balance to the region effected but there is a limit to the engagement by military personnel (drones) - there is a new chapter in our effort with nigeria as of last summer - that is a practical fact as of last summer - i am not accusing you of plotting the country involvement with this AUMF - i have to explain this to my children 15 years from now as to why we did this
Corker - apologizes to Sec. Kerry for prolonging his stay at the committee meeting if he has other commitments - Kerry - today the us treasury has engaged more sanctions on Yanukovych folks and added more non-lethal assistance
Corker turns to General Dempsey but Carter answers - the legal authority to respond to an attack by Assad is not known yet - ya think? (there is no AUMF yet, is that right?)
Corker - he is concerned about protecting folks against Assad - (someone needs to remind him of the successful removal of chemical weapons - Dempsey - appreciates the chairman's concern for our time today - states corker has run a very cordial meeting today and that was nice - the program won't succeed unless the trained troops understand they have a strong sense of survival - Corker - to get Turkey on the ground - Dempsey - effective ground effort - Dempsey - military advise is under discussion now - the AUMF would not provide that permission today - Carter - there could be provisions when the forces we equip are under attack can receive support but all this is under discussions - Corner - states there is lack of commitment from the white house if all this isn't up front in the AUMF - Persian Gulf War - enduring ground combat language - seven month authorization would be too long for this AUMF - Carter - going against another state is different than this and I don't believe that will apply here - Corker - is 2 to 3 years too long for enduring? - Carter - we don't know how long it will take to defeat ISIS - the three years is based in realizing there will be another president to assess this (Why don't they remember that?)
Menendez - we need to find relief form sequester - get to a point to find the right balance to degrade and defeat ISIL but it is not an open ended check - some of us who lived under 'shock and awe' was told iraqi oil would pay for everything and that was a deception - today there is not a democrat or republican that is not committed to degrade and end ISIL it is just a matter of finding the exact language.
Corker - he has a note - the DOD senior lawyers are sitting behind you - neither one of this AUMF or 2001 provides for training and equipping anti-Assad forces - i would like to close how much we appreciate you and the service to our country - the record is open to friday and there will be questions allowed until then - meeting adjourned.
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